CHM Help opened with F1 from some dialogs, after closing then not released by TC, and not re opened with F1 if unlocked

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Re: CHM Help opened with F1 from some dialogs, after closing then not released by TC, and not re opened with F1 if unloc

Post by *Dalai »

2Usher
There is no separate process used to open TC's CHM help files when pressing F1 in TC, so I'm pretty sure the help is hosted inside of totalcmd.exe, which is also supported by the fact that totalcmd.exe locks the CHM files (which was mentioned previously by other users).

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Re: CHM Help opened with F1 from some dialogs, after closing then not released by TC, and not re opened with F1 if unloc

Post by *Usher »

Well, the only problem is with NTFS rights for different users. Users with restricted rights can do only a few selected actions if they aren't the owners of the file/folder.
You can test the following steps (valid for both XP Home and Pro systems):

1. Login to your user account with Administrator rights, close TC if it's open, use Windows Explorer to rename TC folder (for example, to C:\Totalcmd.bak), and don't close Explorer yet.
2. In Explorer change view to Details (if needed) and add column for Owner. Note who's the owner of Totalcmd.bak folder, then open the folder and check if there are any files with different owner - note them as well.
In Windows XP Pro you can check what rights are granted to all users - full control or restricted. If the rights are restricted, note which ones aren't enabled - that is your answer. But it's not the end of the test.
3. Login to your user account with restricted rights and reinstall TC to its original location (for example, to C:\Totalcmd).
4. Open Explorer and repeat actions from step 2 for new TC folder. Note owners carefully. ONE owner, I think ;-)
5. Run TC, press F1 to open CHM help, press Esc to close help.
6. Now it's time for the show! Open C:\Totalcmd.bak in one TC pane and C:\Totalcmd in another pane. Copy (don't move, keep backup just in case…) all files and subfolders from the old C:\Totalcmd.bak to the new C:\Totalcmd. Did you have more than ONE (for totalcmd.exe itself) problem with overwriting?
7. Go back to Explorer, refresh view for C:\Totalcmd folder and search for any changed owner. TC by default doesn't copy original rights, so all copied files and folders should inherit rights from the base folder which means it's still the same owner.
8. Now go back to your user account with Administrator rights. Open Notepad to create a new text file, write a few word in it, save it to C:\Totalcmd folder and close Notepad.
9. Go to Explorer and check owner of the newly created text file.
10. Go back to your user account with limited rights. Use TC to view that text file. Then use Notepad to open the text again. Is it possible now? If it's possible, make a few changes in the text and try to save it. It failed, didn't it? So try to overwrite it with another file. Failed again? So finally try to delete it - success?

That's all in this test. I can only add that it's not so easy to grant full control rights for all users in Windows XP Home. By default it's available only for Administrator (user with such rights) in safe mode (so it looks like @petermad have omitted some interesting config details of his "almost pristine" XP Home).

Edit. WARNING! When using Explorer, don't try to sort by Owner root C:\ folder or any folder with subfolders/files locked by system.
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Re: CHM Help opened with F1 from some dialogs, after closing then not released by TC, and not re opened with F1 if unloc

Post by *DrShark »

Usher wrote:
2020-02-29, 16:02 UTC
You can test the following steps (valid for both XP Home and Pro systems)
Are your steps to reproduce or to avoid CHM file lock problem? On my PC with WinXP Pro where TC process locks it, I tried also separate portable TC installation (dir with only 3 files: TOTALCMD.EXE, TOTALCMD.CHM, WCMZIP32.DLL) on ExFAT (I have a driver installed for it) drive - there after calling the help with F1 and closing it, TC process locks it too.
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Re: CHM Help opened with F1 from some dialogs, after closing then not released by TC, and not re opened with F1 if unloc

Post by *Usher »

1. Once again: CHM is closed and unused by any process so there is NO lock. There are problems with restricted NTFS rights. It's warning like "You do not have sufficient rights to perform this operation" for floppy disk formatting - it doesn't mean that the floppy disk is write protected.

2. I described how to check the restrictions and create TC folder with full rights for restricted user. Then I noted that user with Admin rights may always take ownership so it's NOT the right way to avoid problems. The only way is to grant full control rights for all users. You can find many webpages with instructions how to take ownership and/or grant full control rights to any user.

Just test it, please, and report results. Some steps may be inaccurate, but it's still better way to understand nuances…

3. Totalcmd.exe is open and in use, wcmzip32.dll is kept open by TC (or rather memory mapped) after its first use, the same for other dlls or plugins.

4. ExFAT is NOT NTFS. AFAIK, rights restrictions available for ExFAT are disabled by default, at least for non-system, portable drives, but I may be wrong. And it's another nuance which might be omitted by @petermad and other users.

"I don't ask why patients lie, I just assume they all do." So far all of you provided different result with zero needed information. It's time to change it: Provide file system, ownership of TC folder and TotalCMD.CHM, rights (Administrator or restricted) of listed owners.
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Re: CHM Help opened with F1 from some dialogs, after closing then not released by TC, and not re opened with F1 if unloc

Post by *DrShark »

Usher wrote:
2020-02-29, 21:14 UTC
1. Once again: CHM is closed and unused by any process so there is NO lock. There are problems with restricted NTFS rights. It's warning like "You do not have sufficient rights to perform this operation" for floppy disk formatting - it doesn't mean that the floppy disk is write protected.
OK, the lock you describe and the lock which happens to me and ghisler(Author) are different kind of locks: yours is NTFS rights lock, so no way to replace the chm file unless the rights are granted.
The lock which happens to me and Christian Ghisler: start TC, replace %COMMANDER_PATH%\TOTALCMD.CHM -> goes ok, press F1, close help, try replacing again: there is an access denied error on try to overwrite the file. The CHM is locked by TOTALCMD.EXE handle until Total Commander is closed.
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Re: CHM Help opened with F1 from some dialogs, after closing then not released by TC, and not re opened with F1 if unloc

Post by *petermad »

Provide file system, ownership of TC folder and TotalCMD.CHM, rights (Administrator or restricted) of listed owners.
My data:
File system = FAT32
Ownership of TC folder and TotalCMD.CHM = N/A on FAT32
Rights = Administrator (the only account under this OS).
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Re: CHM Help opened with F1 from some dialogs, after closing then not released by TC, and not re opened with F1 if unloc

Post by *ghisler(Author) »

I have two installations of XP:
1. XP64 Service Pack 2 English -> Help cannot be unloaded (neither with 32-bit nor 64-bit Total Commander)
2. XP32 Service Pack 3 English -> Help can be unloaded

Either it was fixed in Service Pack 3, or it's a problem with the 64-bit version.
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Re: CHM Help opened with F1 from some dialogs, after closing then not released by TC, and not re opened with F1 if unloc

Post by *DrShark »

ghisler(Author) wrote:
2020-03-01, 07:52 UTC
I have two installations of XP:
1. XP64 Service Pack 2 English -> Help cannot be unloaded (neither with 32-bit nor 64-bit Total Commander)
2. XP32 Service Pack 3 English -> Help can be unloaded

Either it was fixed in Service Pack 3, or it's a problem with the 64-bit version.
I have a lock on 32-bit XP Pro with SP3, so it's probably neither a 64-bit version (for which, BTW, SP3 has never been released) nor Service Pack 3 issue (because other users don't have a lock on their 32-bit XP).

My guess is that either it was fixed by some Internet Explorer or Windows post-SP3 update, or XP didn't have this bug from start and some update introduced this bug. It's also possible that this lock behavior has nothing to do with updates, but caused by some Windows or Internet Explorer setting.

The only way to find the update which fixes/adds the bug or to rule out updates as a reason is to install Windows/IE updates one by one on clean Windows or removing them one by one from fully patched one.
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