Lister: "internal" has no checkmark

[funkymonk]

In lister's plugin menu, the currently used plugin has a checkmark right in front of it.
However, this checkmark is missing for "internal". It doesn't even show up if "internal" is selected explicitly.

TC 10.50b6x32/dark @ Win10x64

[trafan]

confirmed!

Same Behavier here.
TC10.5 B6 x64 - win10 21H1


EDIT: As @AntonDudarenko in the next post wrote...

[AntonyD]

Not confirm!
Because now this checkmark is set only if indeed internal processing was used.
For ex, open some JPG first of all without plugins (ALT+SHIFT+F3) and Lister uses mode 1 or 2.
Now - click on the <internal> menu item - and you will see that first of all JPG file will be rendered as a picture
and secondly - checkmark will be set:)
And thirdly: Lister will use the mode 4) right now.

Author write this:

For now I will check "Internal" for one of the two internal media players and for RTF. I will not do it for Irfanview, because it converts the image to BMP and TC handles that directly.

[trafan]

Oh, sorry @AntonDudarenko,

i testet it with a txt file and a xlsx file earlier (with RedCell Plugin). As i switched to internal on the xlsx, the checkmark on internal was missing.
I tried, as you said, with an image - and yes, the checkmark on Internal appears.

I didn't know about this behaviour

[AntonyD]

Now this checkmark is show the REAL internal processing of opened file.
Thus if you open some bla-bla file with help of some plugin which supports such files - then you will see corresponding checkmark right next to the Name of this plugin in Lister's menu "Plugins".
And IF you suddenly decide to use internal capabilities of Lister itself in order to view bla-bla file - and will try to use <internal> checkmark - then ONLY IF indeed the Lister will support rendering of such bla-bla file within itself - only then you will see this checkmark right next to the Name <internal>!
That is, It all makes more sense now. If there's an opportunity, it's marked and working. If not, nothing will happen.

[funkymonk]

And IF you suddenly decide to use internal capabilities of Lister itself in order to view bla-bla file - and will try to use <internal> checkmark - then ONLY IF indeed the Lister will support rendering of such bla-bla file within itself - only then you will see this checkmark right next to the Name <internal>!

Not here.

With a file that is internally supported by TC (e.g., jpg or png):

* If I open Lister with mode 1 or 2, the "internal" plugin is not selected. For me that is arguable, since ascii/hex representation is also an internal representation. But ok, let's say it's fine.
If I then click plugins->internal, TC switches to mode 4 and shows the checkmark for internal. That's certainly fine.

* If I open Lister with some plugin, TC uses mode 4 and checkmarks the plugin. That's also fine.
If I then click plugins->internal, TC switches to (or stays in) mode 4 and shows the image correctly "rendered" (not ascii/hex mode). But: Internal is *not* checkmarked. That's not as expected, right?

[AntonyD]

For me that is arguable, since ascii/hex representation is also an internal representation.

we talk not about the built-in abilities of used Framework|Prog.Lang|Win32API lib| etc.
ascii/hex are exactly the kind of life-necessary and built-in things. Thus here we should not somehow to highlight that point.
But here we talk about the implemented in addition internal things which improve the built-on abilities.

- "Internal / RTF",
- "Internal / LAVfilters"
- "Internal / system media filters"
- "Internal / Old Media Player"
- "Internal / IrfanView"

that's how on our forum member Usher highlighted these additional capabilities
To which the author responded as I quoted above:

For now I will check "Internal" for one of the two internal media players and for RTF. I will not do it for Irfanview, because it converts the image to BMP and TC handles that directly.

And here it is another good quote:

I agree that the "Internal" menu option should only have a checkmark if TC's internal "plugin" (Mediaplayer / GDI+ / DirectShow / MCI / IrfanView | XnView) is in use, not when Lister mode 1,2,3,5,6,7 is in use.

*************************************
As to this:

If I then click plugins->internal, TC switches to (or stays in) mode 4 and shows the image correctly "rendered" (not ascii/hex mode). But: Internal is *not* checkmarked. That's not as expected, right?

I did not understand it fully. Sorry.
IF you opened some bla-bla file with Lister and WITH help of installed plugin BLA-BLA_OPENING - then you see the rendering of content of this file with help of this plugin, right? And yes - now Lister is in mode 4, right? IF you will click now <internal> item - then Lister should switch to mode 2! (or 1 - in fewer uses) - because Lister itself does not have abilities to render bla-bla file's content! No picture is magically rendered in the window in this case!

[funkymonk]

I did not understand it fully. Sorry.

Seems so.

IF you opened some bla-bla file with Lister and WITH help of installed plugin BLA-BLA_OPENING - then you see the rendering of content of this file with help of this plugin, right?

Right.

And yes - now Lister is in mode 4, right?

Right.

IF you will click now <internal> item - then Lister should switch to mode 2! (or 1 - in fewer uses) - because Lister itself does not have abilities to render bla-bla file's content! No picture is magically rendered in the window in this case!

No! Please read my post properly.
I was talking about an image file format that *is* supported by TC. Thus, TC stays in (or goes to) mode 4 and it *does* display the image properly.
However, even though we are in mode 4, *no* item is checkmarked in the plugins menu -- neither a plugin nor "internal".

[AntonyD]

However, even though we are in mode 4, *no* item is checkmarked in the plugins menu -- neither a plugin nor "internal".

not confirm. all is properly function in this case (we try to open a real PICTURE file firstly without any plugins after that - with help of internal plug) on my machine, sorry.

Pls, try as usually with fresh INI and with some newly downloaded pictures)))
or send the link to yours variant - which you try to open. I will try to do the same.

[funkymonk]

I can narrow down the problem further.

It seems to depend on "Define view method by file type" in the lister configuration:

* If a plugin is defined here for an extension (e.g., imagine for *.jpg), then the checkmark is missing for internal when switching between internal and imagine (it is displayed for imagine).

* If no plugin is defined for the extension, then the checkmark is displayed correctly.

[AntonyD]

I can confirm this sequence of actions as the one leading to the announced bug.
I've added a preview on all images through the ULister plugin. Opened the image, the picture was rendered.
Then I clicked on the <Internal> element at menu Plugins and... the image was redrawn by the internal Viewer/Lister mechanism
but the checkmark really wasn't ticked! Congratulations funkymonk! Finding that kind of relation is a very successful move!

[ghisler(Author)]

I think it's easier when I always check "internal" when in mode 4 and no plugin is used.

[funkymonk]

I think it's easier when I always check "internal" when in mode 4 and no plugin is used.

Isn't that anyway how it should be?

[ghisler(Author)]

It depends on what you consider an internal plug-in:
- RTF control? Yes.
- Media Player? Yes.
- JPG/PNG/GIF/BMP viewer? Not really?
- Image loaded via Irfanview? Difficult to say.
- 3rd party Lister plugin? Definitely not.

So always checking it for mode 4 except for 3rd party plugins is easier.

[funkymonk]

For me, "internal" refers to functionality that is inherent to TC, i.e., features that come out of the box and are *not* added through plugins, additional tools, etc.
Regarding the wording, I would even distinguish between "internal functionality" (not a plugin) and "plugin" (always an add-on).

Regarding the "internal" item in the plugins menu, I got from the discussion that the entire menu refers to Mode 4 (Multimedia) only.
I can live with that. Still, I find this not very comprehensive -- especially since there is no clear indication about this link between Mode 4 and the plugins menu.

Here is my suggestion towards more consistency / comprehensiveness:

For *all* modes (text, bin, hex, ...), "internal" should be checkmarked once TC displays a file with its internal functionality.
Once a plugin is used (also independent from the mode), the plugin should be checkmarked.

Side note:
Yes, I know, plugins will always switch to Multimedia Mode. Still, activating a specific (and valid) plugin switches to this mode anyways.

On the other hand, when clicking "internal" for a file that is not inherently supported by TC, Lister will leave Mode 4 (which is functionally correct but not directly visible to the user since it happens "silently" in another menu) and leaves "internal" unchecked. It is certainly not comprehensive to most users that explicitly clicking "internal" leaves this item unchecked while clicking on a plugin selects the plugin. Why not simply switch to another mode (e.g., binary) and still leave "internal" checked? In fact, this other mode *does* use internal TC functionality to display the file...